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Robin Dale says:

29 June 2020 at 5:15 pm Edit

Hey Adam, thanks a lot for the blog. I am about to begin a Computer Science MSc, and am particularly interested in what AI can teach us about the human mind and foundational reality. I really appreciate the balance you strike between technical explanation and philosophical ideas. Keep it up!

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Adam Elwood says:

29 June 2020 at 5:51 pm Edit

Hi Robin, I’m glad you’re enjoying the blog! Please feel free to share it with people you think will find it interesting. It’s a new project, so anything to help get the word out would be much appreciated.

Good luck with your MSc, it’s definitely an exciting field to be getting involved in now! If you have any specific questions or ideas relating to AI and ML feel free to drop me an email ( adam@pursuingreality.com )

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Anoop says:

25 December 2020 at 9:19 pm Edit

“As humans, can we really ever hope to comprehend reality as it is?”

As humans, the answer seems to have to be no, since to be biologically human is to limit ourselves to a particular swath of reality via brain, mind, sense organs. But perhaps we are not only human. Perhaps the biological human apparatus is an aspect of us, one which we have exclusively focused on, akin to an avatar in a game. If so, we may be able to access more than imagined by investigating the layers of our identity, though comprehending reality would always entail modifying it in some way.

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Jacco says:

12 January 2021 at 2:39 pm Edit

Since the interpretation of input and output of any DNN proces is an act of conceiving for people in case, there can’t be any meaning or sense derived from – or addressed to the DNN proces itself. In other words, there’s no agency or ‘that which knows’ involved internally in any proces of AI.

Besides, @Robin, AI won’t teach us anything fundamental about the human mind, since what we know as, for instance, a mental proces leading to ’eureka’ is an *experience* in our consciousness. We recognize this ‘eureka’ knowingly as a commonality and regularity of a mental proces. However the outcome of a DNN process resembles the throughput of a human thought proces leading to ‘eureka’ (still in example), a DNN remains just a model and nothing more than exactly that. In that respect we solely deal with inferences and abstractions grasping for ‘the real’ process. It’s the same like Newtonian physics is super ingenious inferences on the regularity of phenomena of the inanimate world, giving NO essential clues whatsoever.

Since there’s no experiencer in any, regardless how sophisticated, DNN process, there’s meaning nor sense inherently to it. It’s us, humans, conscious agents that actually address meaning and knowledge to the input as well as to the output. Knowing and sense of meaning are acts in consciousness.

So there’s no depth to the ‘deep’ in DNN in and of itself. We ourselves keep sense for AI (if any) afloat, lifting it by it bootstraps. It’s us, looking in the abyss, shivering from the uncanny.

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Adam Elwood says:

12 January 2021 at 2:52 pm Edit

At their base, our brains are just big complicated neural networks right? The big difference between our brains and the DNNs prevalent in computer science is that our brains are full of feedback loops, with outputs influencing input, whereas DNNs tend to just be feed-forward. However, I don’t see why understanding more about neural networks in general couldn’t help us to understand how our brains work.

However… this still leaves the question of consciousness completely open. If you believe what some panpsychists say, DNNs could well be conscious. Although clearly not in the way we are.

One thing I’d be careful of is not confusing consciousness and meaning. Consciousness comes first, whereas meaning is just another layer built on top of it – a particular representation held in our consciousness, which helps us make sense of our suffering.

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Jacco says:

31 January 2021 at 11:21 pm Edit

hi Adam,

Appreciate your quick response. Forgot to mention that I enjoy your blog and the both interesting and well written article!

I don’t think I conflate consciousness with meaning, thanks for suggesting. And yes, our brains can be considered neuro networks, but a simulation of the network of (i.e.) the London subway doesn’t provide the quality of the ride, let alone its extended implications and functionalities for metropolitan “metabolism”.

My comment above was driven by the worry that comes up in me when people – scientists, engineers, philosophers, freaks, whichever – start to impose machine analogies on human beings, life and henceforth on humanity and the world in the grand perspective. For me personally this worry has been a heart felt issue for a long time, which I always found hard to reasonably substantiate. It ’s only recent that I found a strong and clearly, rationally argued case for it in the ideas of Bernardo Kastrup. Bernardo Kastrup is a colleague physicist of yours, and besides that, he’s a strong and lucid thinker, philosopher PhD, postulating clear cut metaphysics on consciousness and (among many other issues) artificial sentience. I just want to recommend him to you. If you’re interested, you could watch this one: https://youtu.be/VhJx-4n5xeA

I think it could be a good match as I’ve read a bit on your interests.

I think any person working in the field of AI (or AC – Artificial Cleverness? – courtesy sir Roger Penrose) or it’s subsequent utilization’s could do a better grace to humanity when they would adhere to a worldview that would be non mechanistic and would engross meaning to existence and life. Regarding this argument: If you might eventually catch up with Bernardo Kastrup’s ideas my utter recommendation would be to read his book “More Than Allegory”, which offers a truly excellent narrative covering the substrate of existence and m e a n i n g , fullly fitting the inclinations of Western thought and mythology.

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